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The Legend won't be coming to the South Side

[SF Chronicle]:

The Giants have acquired a new center fielder, and he will be in San Francisco for a long time. The team will announce this afternoon it has signed Aaron Rowand to a five-year contract. Terms were not immediately available. Rowand, 30, has spent seven seasons in the majors, five with the White Sox and the last two with the Phillies, and owns a career batting average of .286 with a .343 on-base percentage. In 2007, playing at hitter-friendly Citizens Bank Park, Rowand established career highs of 27 home runs and 89 RBIs. He also has a reputation as a tough, gritty outfielder, perhaps best-remembered for a 2006 catch with the Phillies in which he crashed face-first into the fence in Chicago and broke his nose, all the while holding onto the baseball.
wow!
Terms of the deal were not disclosed, although the value of Rowand's contract was believed to have approached the five-year, $90 million package that Torii Hunter, another free-agent center fielder, recently received from the Los Angeles Angels reported by the Associated Press to be $60 million.
*****
Regarding Mr. Fukudome:
One Padres official told the San Diego Union-Tribune the negotiations came down to "Show me the money." The Cubs obviously have more money to spend than the small-market Padres and the White Sox offer was never seriously considered. San Diego immediately regrouped and signed second baseman Tadahito Iguchi to one-year, $4 million deal, and are expected to try and re-sign centerfielder Mike Cameron.
Update [2007-12-12 18:36:25 by The Cheat]: According to one report, the White Sox (and maybe others) were the high bidder for Fukudome.
In particular, manager Lou Piniella paid off for the Cubs again... helping sway Fukudome away from the higher-bidding White Sox and others.
*****
In other news,
  • Jim looks at the remaining CF options. BTW, Kosuke Fukudome's projections: PECOTA: .289/.401/.504. CHONE: .283/.373/.465. ZiPS: .293/.382/.460.
  • The Astros acquired Miguel Tejada for 5 players (outfielder Luke Scott, pitchers Matt Albers, Troy Patton and Dennis Sarfate and third baseman Mike Costanzo). Tejada has 2 players remaining on his contract. BTW, the A's sure like our relievers. And the Royals non-tendered OF Emil Brown.
  • Hot Stove: Willie Randolph is considering Jason Marquis. And Omar wouldn't trade Milledge for Garland? -- The Padres signed Tadahito to a 1-year deal, and are after Mike Cameron, and Jason Bay. Scratch the Jason Bay part. -- The Rockies are targeting Luis Vizcaino. The Pirates too.

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*Whew*
Rowand's one of my favorite players, but I didn't want to see him back on the Sox.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 3:04 PM CST   0 recs

5 years for The Legend
The Giants will regret this.

by Big Daddy Kool on Dec 12, 2007 3:06 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Five years.
Probably at least 60 million. That's too much. We've got options that make more sense than that.

by dantesox on Dec 12, 2007 3:07 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I'll second that.
Rowand is a great guy with a great attitude, and I'm so glad that we didn't sign him for five years.  I like to see him getting a big payday, but I'm glad that my team isn't saddled with that contract.

by palehose67 on Dec 12, 2007 3:09 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

nice
now we can read jay mariotti tomorrow on how williams sucks!! hahaha, im glad hes not comin back for that price.
"We had a guy go into 2nd base as if his wife was turning a double play."

by The Deacon on Dec 12, 2007 3:11 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Hello, 2009
 As soon as Thome hits the DL, we can get my hopeful outfield of Sweeney, Owens, and Quentin (with Dye at DH). Hell, we may even see BA!

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:06 PM CST   0 recs

The pain, only my enemies
should know.  Oy!

Is it now official?  KW has been pantsed by the Cubs, Giants, Angels, and Tigers.  As Mel Allen once said, how about that?

"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:09 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I think the pantsing of KW
has, at this point, devolved to that SNL skit of 'oops I crapped my pants.' Get KW a diaper.

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:11 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I think we can make the argument
for the other teams mentioned (though the joke is still funny) but KW got pantsed by the Angels. He thought he had Hunter lock, stock, ready to sign on the dotted line. Then he checked mlb,com and saw Torii in a Angels hat (exaggeration, of course). Regardless of whether any of us wanted Hunter or not, that was Kenny's 1A, and he got the carpet pulled from beneath his feet.

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:14 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Maybe...
but this is a terrible signing by the Giants (assuming that it's for more than $10 million a year), and it would have been terrible for the White Sox. There are things to legitimately criticize Williams for, but not signing Rowand isn't one of them.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 3:17 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Irregardless...
this is a bit of a slight on KW's ability to go out and bring in, as WU said, the 'big fish.' This is not the way KW saw his offseason going.

I mean, I hear this rhetoric all the time, of 'well, it was a bad singing' coming from all over. Soriano was a bad signing, Hunter was bad, now Rowand is bad. So what's the alternative, never sign a big name? And what, rely on our farm system?

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:21 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I agree...
Every free agent is over-priced I guess. A bad or bad signing is a lot more complicated than that -- depends on the return you get for resources expended. Ans I think fear of a big immovable contract for an aging player in the future is a little unfounded in a lot of cases. Lots of contracts can be moved if some money is thrown, and inflation makes big deals look less bad over time.

I'd be interested if there's ever been a FA signing (aside from bargain ones like Dye) that JRE thought were good.

I agree that signing Hunter to a 5 year deal for $90M would have been bad.

But if the Sox had money to spend this offseason and that money disappears without adding much needed talent of any kind to the Sox this season, I'm not sure that's a good thing.

by hitlesswonder on Dec 12, 2007 3:29 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Context...
is everything. The Fukudome signing was good for the Cubs. It would have been bad for the Sox.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 3:41 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Immovable contracts
The way the market expands in baseball, this year's huge, bad, immovable contract looks reasonable in 2 to 3 years.  See Jacque Jones.
"Can I borrow your towel? I think my car just hit a water buffalo." - Fletch

by mdmnd9294 on Dec 12, 2007 4:22 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

yeah
that was a real easy contract to move. only took like six months. and they get the privilege of paying detroit to take him. sounds like a really reasonable thing.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 12, 2007 4:27 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

It's not uncommon
to trade a player with cash when a team is trying to move him.  That provides flexibility and is cheaper in the long run.  The Sox acquired Cabrera with cash, even though the Angels took on the bigger contract of Garland.

KW should consider that if he was ever serious about moving Contreras, but maybe the White Sox piggy bank can't pull that off.

"Can I borrow your towel? I think my car just hit a water buffalo." - Fletch

by mdmnd9294 on Dec 12, 2007 4:39 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

But that...
undermines your point.  If you have to include cash to trade a contract, it's not a "reasonable" contract.  You're acknowledging that the contract makes the player less attractive.

And Williams is absolutely right to hold onto Contreras, at least for now.  His trade value can't get much lower.  Williams would have trouble getting  a BP screen in exchange for Contreras right now.  So why not give him a dozen starts or so in 2008, see if he can't put the pieces back together, and deal him to a pitching-starved contender?

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 4:43 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

OK
You've convinced me that JJ was a bad example;   A "reasonable" contract is also contigent on the player performing, which he did not until the end of '07.  I'm still surprised that anybody took him.

But I'm not comfortable with the team relying on Contreras going into '08, but I agree there's not much to do.  BP screen, indeed!  That's a lot of "wishin' and hopin'", which I think the White Sox have done a lot of recently.

"Can I borrow your towel? I think my car just hit a water buffalo." - Fletch

by mdmnd9294 on Dec 12, 2007 5:16 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

some are more bad than others
this is a more bad one.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 12, 2007 3:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Your pro bono opinion?
Do the Sox trade for an OF or is Quentin-Owens-Dye in 2008?

by hitlesswonder on Dec 12, 2007 3:47 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

owens is opening day CF
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 12, 2007 3:49 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Although that was directed towards Larry...
I'll up a prediction and say, when either Dye or Thome go on the DL (and Dye moves to DH) Sweeney will take over right. Quentin-Owens-Sweeney.

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:51 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

C'mon, JRE
Where are the "big fish"?  Swimming in someone else's pond, bro.  Yes, he may not've been going for Rowand or Fuku but you have to admit (well, ou just have to) he's struck out on bagging the elephant.  He's better at crappies.
"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:16 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

There were no...
"big fish" this winter, other than Miguel Cabrera, and the Sox never had the pieces to trade for Cabrera. I'm happy about all of this. The sooner the Sox wake up and realise that they're not going to contend in the near future, the better.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 3:18 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

So why did he set the expectation
with his "BF" quote?  Just jacking with the fans?  What kind of disingenious PR is that?  He thought he had at least one wrapped up.

Now, I agree, we can admit we may not BAG the big fish but instead will be SLEEPING with them for the near future.

"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:20 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Well...
even if this isn't how Williams saw the offseason going, I'm glad he's not jumping in with a ridiculous offer to trump all these other ridiculous offers just so he can say he "did something".

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 3:28 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

He did do something
He committed $100mm to 14 players for 2008, and the roster that he built for his $100-115mm next year will be hard pressed to play .500 baseball.  Signing a quality FA was needed to inject some talent into this team without further thinning out the minors, and he didn't pull it off.  Failing to sign the big fish makes the rest of the payroll an extravagant waste of money.
"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:45 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

The 2008 Payroll...
was going to be a waste of money no matter what Kenny Williams did. The 2008 White Sox are not going to the playoffs, and no free agent signing was going to change that. All Williams can do is try to limit the damage to only one season or two. This is not the time to bring in a pricey free agent.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 4:28 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Really? I think this will be a .500
team.  I think that's what Kenny constructed.  LF was a disaster for us last year and considering what an offensive premium that position gets, it was responsible for much of our overall suck.  Same with 3rd base, where Crede and Andy the Quite Possibly Worst Player In All of MLB took us to new lows.  Both of those will be solved to some degree, replaced with younger .750-.800 OPS players with upside.  Oh I almost forgot what a bat-and-ball abortion Uribe authored last year.  Now we get a .750-.830 OPS SS with solid defense to replace him.

What did we lose?  Garland, a draft pick, and a year of age for all of our aging players.  I don't think that drags us back to last place.  We'll just have a good chance of total collapse, is all.

His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 12, 2007 5:32 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

He sort of has been pantsed
His plan was to bring in a FA CF and trade for Cabrera and -- that was "going for it". And he fantastically misjudged the resources that it would require to get those moves done. It's a significant mistake given that he gave up $20M and 2nd round pick for a middle reliever and traded for a 33 year-old rental SS instead of prospects with his best trade-bait.

You can say that Williams hasn't done much to hurt the long-term future of the club (yet....), but protecting the "future" wasn't his goal this offseason as witnessed by his other moves.  

by hitlesswonder on Dec 12, 2007 3:20 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Jimmy Two Times!
Where you been?  How do you really feel about Rowand's signing, JRE?

;)

"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:06 PM CST   0 recs

haha
We're officially down to the stems and seeds.  Too bad Corey Patterson's a Boras client.
"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:13 PM CST   0 recs

IF....
Kenny tries to sign Cameron to a 1- or 2-year deal, he will have come up with my second choice for CF this offseason.  (I wish he would have signed Andruw Jones for the price the Dodgers got.)  Rowand and Hunter are dodged bullets...I would prefer Corey Patterson for two years to either of them.

If Cameron doesn't sign, I bet Kenny makes a trade.    My anxiety there is dealing Fautino or Gio for marginal returns.

by asinwreck on Dec 12, 2007 3:22 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

no way
I'd just as soon we played Owens before we put Patterson out there.  Thank God we still have Jerry, cause we need that flexibility.
"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:27 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Kenny Williams is committed to a championship!!!
Unfortunately, so is every other team.  Next season is going to suck if we have to hear about "the vision" and then "how the performance sickens him, like a punch in the stomach".

by LVSoxFan on Dec 12, 2007 3:16 PM CST   0 recs

I feel bad for Buehrle
He's probably thinking to himself, "WTF, I left all this money on the table to come back to four years of this?"
"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:16 PM CST   0 recs

He could've been caught in the
death trap that has become St. Louis.  Chicago still rules.

But if he's a serious ballplayer he must be envious as hell.

"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:17 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Hopefully he'll waive his NTC
and the Sox can flip him to St. Louis for some prospects...

by hitlesswonder on Dec 12, 2007 3:23 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Ha
Tomorrow's headline, "Buehrle offers Sox $2,000,000 to void his No Trade Clause"
"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

In hindsight,
I'm perfectly happy with not signing Hunter, Rowand (especially if it really took 5 years), Jones, or Fuk. I've also come around to realize that Garland didn't have much value, although as larry pointed out at the get-go, it would have been nice for KW to wait to see rather than setting the market. I'm also happy with Quentin and glad the Sox didn't mortgage the next ten years for two years of Cabrera.

But Linebrink, oh Linebrink. At this point, failing to land any "big fish" as wu would say, does Kenny regret this signing?

"I was up in the stand and I seen the bear. It came from thar thicket and it was beside the road and I shot it."

by Toonderstrook on Dec 12, 2007 3:22 PM CST   0 recs

My thought exactly.
Unless he is like Bullwinkle ("nothin' up my sleeve!  Presto!") and is planning to make a grand gesture that none/few of us can see, that signing was a terrible waste of resources.
"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

This is the question:
most of us breathed a sigh of relief with Rowand going somewhere else. But does KW see the same things we see now, the same things most of us saw for the past 15 months, or will he continue to bank on the here and now, ignoring that the whole system needs an overhaul?

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

That's the $500,000 question...
isn't it?

My guess is that the Sox stand pat and simply not make any more moves this winter, but who knows?

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 12, 2007 3:27 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

What annoys me
is that he had this goofy plan, which was predicated upon signing the top FA this winter.  So based on the assumption that he WILL sign Hunter, he extends MB, JD, Uribe and AJ.  Then trades JG for OC & Linebrink.  And then he fails to land the big fish.  Since the linchpin of this whole plan was signing Hunter, all of these other moves were just a horrible waste of money and resources.

Totally bass ackwards.

"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:32 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

To top it off, Hunter isn't that good
He's a good player, but no perennial all-star. Hunter wasn't going to lift the Sox into contention.

If MCab was part of plan, that would be more understandable....

by hitlesswonder on Dec 12, 2007 3:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Kenny has a plan, oh yeah baby!
From November 3:
With so many needs, Ken Williams won't stay under the radar this off-season. In fact, the White Sox's general manager believes he's in position to pull off a trade, perhaps as soon as this week at the annual general manager meetings that start Monday in Orlando.

"I have a definite plan," Williams said Friday in a telephone interview while en route to an Arizona Fall League game. "The one challenge is our free-agent list and how much we can afford and how those players fit. But once those dominoes start to fall, things will start to fall quickly." Williams gave an emphatic "yes" when asked if he can make deals before Nov. 13--the first day teams can make financial offers to free agents.

Furthermore, Williams said Josh Fields' permanent position for 2008 would be revealed shortly, which could be predicated on a trade. "It will all be resolved soon," said Williams, who wouldn't share any hints.

Kenny, you were right - it's all been resolved.  Yeesh.  Now that the prime FAs who could actually make a 2-5 win impact are all spoken for, I just hope he doesn't freak out and start trading the few good young players we have in a desperate attempt to salvage 2008.

"We can stay with Jerry Owens in center field...So we've got a lot of flexibility" - Kenny Williams

by ChicagoPete on Dec 12, 2007 3:23 PM CST   0 recs

Yeah, my wife PLANS
to perform oral on me some day this century.  That's the plan....I just don't know the details.  I might already be dead when that happens.
"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 3:27 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

But Winning,
once those dominoes start to fall...oh baby!!!

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:29 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

better late
than never....

There is a fifth dimension beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call........... the Kenny Zone.

by Air Raid Siren Stan on Dec 12, 2007 4:03 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

We are now on to Plan QR-aa
Don't worry...Super Kenny knows what he is doing.  

by BobbySouthSide on Dec 12, 2007 3:30 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Just wait untill Soxfest....
Unless KW has some earth shattering trade up his sleeve, just wait. There will be a line with people and pitch forks...

by Tony82087 on Dec 12, 2007 3:28 PM CST   0 recs

Apology accepted...
I told ya Kenny wasn't spending that $15 million in 2008 that was supposed to be for Torii.  ; )

And that's why "contract offers" don't mean sh!t until a player is signed.

by SSH2005 on Dec 12, 2007 3:31 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Mike Cameron...
Link:
San Diego immediately regrouped and signed second baseman Tadahito Iguchi to one-year, $4 million deal, and are expected to try and re-sign centerfielder Mike Cameron.

So who does Kenny acquire once Cameron re-signs with the Padres?

Corey Patterson?  Trade for Coco Crisp or Juan Pierre?

*pukes*

by SSH2005 on Dec 12, 2007 3:29 PM CST   0 recs

Ozzie wants his speed guy
at the top. Let's face it already: we're looking at Owens or Crisp in CF in 2008.

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

You'll see a grown man cry,
if we trade anything for Juan Pierre.

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:40 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

but, but, but
he looks like such an old-timey ball player with his baggy pants and cockeyed cap.
"I was up in the stand and I seen the bear. It came from thar thicket and it was beside the road and I shot it."

by Toonderstrook on Dec 12, 2007 3:43 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

If we could get him and Paul Byrd,
with his old time windup, we'd be the snappiest bunch in town!

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:50 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

followed by
a take-on-all-comers barnstorming tour of the southwest suburbs.
"I was up in the stand and I seen the bear. It came from thar thicket and it was beside the road and I shot it."

by Toonderstrook on Dec 12, 2007 3:52 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Only the ball was white
"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 4:06 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Keep your pants on
Before the free-agent season, did anyone think it was reasonable to give Hunter or Rowand five years? If someone thought so, I sure never heard about it. So why is Rowand's signing and Hunter's signing continually portrayed as some defeat for the Sox and especially K Williams? Do you really want to be paying $12 m a year for the likes of Jose Guillen, and $18 m a year for a past-his-prime Torii Hunter? Or trading a bunch of your promising prospects for a declining and no-longer-chemically-enhanced Miguel Tejada? I'd like a new CF for 2008, but I'm glad the Sox have passed on the options available so far.

by LittleLooie on Dec 12, 2007 3:31 PM CST   0 recs

A few years ago
We had Lee, Rowand and Maggs in the OF.  Now we have, gulp, Quinten, JO & JD.

Not cool.

by BobbySouthSide on Dec 12, 2007 3:34 PM CST   0 recs

Where were
Lee and Ordonez in the World Series year? And how many have they won since they left the Sox?
"I was up in the stand and I seen the bear. It came from thar thicket and it was beside the road and I shot it."

by Toonderstrook on Dec 12, 2007 3:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I think they were golfing?
Maggs was second in AL MVP last year, Lee was pretty good and so was Rowand.  All were All-Stars.

Not too shabby.  I'd rather have the WS Trophy though.

Looking at the 08' White Sox OF makes me puke.

by BobbySouthSide on Dec 12, 2007 3:45 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

our opening day starting CF
dave roberts......?
they looked at him last year.
"We had a guy go into 2nd base as if his wife was turning a double play."

by The Deacon on Dec 12, 2007 3:42 PM CST   0 recs

Who are we kidding
Kenny ain't got no plan.

He's gonna try to win it his way, with Owens in center feld.

I hate the 2008 season already

AIM : Option27

by Option27 on Dec 12, 2007 3:42 PM CST   0 recs

That makes me think of an old song...
I'm the punky GM, known as K-Williams.
When I hit the winter meetings, I've got no plan.
I just throw some quotes all over the press.
I can't give a dollar, if I haven't got 50 cents.
I motivate the Tigers, I like to tease.
I play so cool, they've got to compete with me.
That's why you all got here on the double
To catch me doin' the Free Agent Shuffle.

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 3:47 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

You are the freakin' MAN, Hulkster
Divorce enhances creativity - from an EXPERT, bro.
"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 12, 2007 6:38 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I've noted your creativity as well, WU...
must be something in doomed relationships that bring out the poet in us all ;)

by HulkSmash on Dec 12, 2007 7:35 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

kw
kw sucks dick, i want someone to kick the shit out of him

by tdegard on Dec 12, 2007 3:48 PM CST   0 recs

Uhm
kids read this site, buddy.

by BobbySouthSide on Dec 12, 2007 3:54 PM CST to parent up   0 recs